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Last one to post wins

Roger S

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I concur with your analysis with one caveat; the winner will ultimately be moi.
 

Trevor Gale

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Yes indeed. I completely agree with your understanding here. The winner will be moi. Made Of Intelligence, that is. Exactly how my mind is constructed.
 

Roger S

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Ne comprende-tu pas francais? Moi se traduit par Me as in I as in this person who is going to win. ;)
 

Trevor Gale

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I know only very little French. You see, moi only needs to know "vous êtes tous à perdre" well enough to make someone else realise their odds.
 

ed taylor

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I have just reduced your odds
 

Roger S

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By a bit more now.
 

ed taylor

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Roger S

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Yes I am, thank you.
 

ed taylor

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Just like me then
 

Roger S

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So, how was your Thanksgiving? Oops, you guys don't have one of those holidays. :)
 

Trevor Gale

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It's my experience, and that of many other winners, that success doesn't come without effort and dedication. Very often it can be observed that the people who have not won are the people who have taken too much time relaxing and going on vacation rather than attending to the important issue, winning. Of course, it does not help if there are too many of these things they call 'holidays'. As it happens, even here in this forum we can observe people who will fail to win who are taking yet another holiday. Still, being the kind, friendly and generous type that I am, I offer my thanksgiving to you for taking that particular 'holiday' and thereby guaranteeing my upcoming win in this forum.
 

ed taylor

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We had a nice drive out to the Peak District today. At least it wasn't raining.
 

Roger S

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We've had a couple of nice cool Fall days to get more of the flower gardens prepared to sleep under that blanket of white that's coming.
 

Trevor Gale

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Here it's as if Nature can't make it's mind up as to whether it ought to be Summer or Winter, yesterday was cold, this morning was colder but the afternoon has warmed up so you'd think it was the end of a summers' day!
 

Roger S

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Not so here. It started cold and then just went to cool.
 

ed taylor

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We dont seem to have seasons anymore. I loved it as a kid. It was sunny in the summer and snow in the winter. Now its a mixed up.
 

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Very true, it would seem. I still remember even over here one winter when the thing to do was to tank a little petrol (gas) in with the diesel when filling-up so as to start easier. Oh and making sure there was always a bit of oil with graphite in it keeping the locks from freezing up. Now it's something to notice when there's actually ice more than an inch or two thick in the garden water tub. As for the summer when we get weeks of 35+ degrees daily, that's not fun either.
 

Roger S

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Since I moved back south by 400 Km, it's quite a curve getting used to the moderate changes from summer to winter here. Up north we had swings from -40 to + 40 between seasons.
 

Trevor Gale

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That's way more of a difference than we're used to over here, I'll admit, but we do also get a lot of wind what with the landscape being so flat (the netherlands), and that's very different to the country I was born in! Makes working up my antenna mast or on the roof darned annoying if the wind gets up, it's more irritating than the rain because everything flaps about and falls away, usually down to the ground or somewhere else that means getting all the way back down to retrieve it. Cold and rain are easier to get used to than the wind, in my experience.
 

Roger S

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I've lived in the worst places in Canada for wind and it drove me batty. Now I live where there are tornadoes most summers and the wind still drives me batty.
 

ed taylor

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Sounds like you might be hard to please Roger
 

Roger S

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I am. I like a nice calm day unless I'm on a sailboat.
 

Trevor Gale

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I have friends who emigrated decades ago to Canada, one married a Canadian man, they're all so very pleased they moved over there especially compared to the various places they knew in Europe, most definitely compared to where we were born and raised (u.K.)!!! The lower-case 'u' is not a mistake, by the ay, since as a result of the 'decision' made 3 years ago the country can no longer be considered as 'united', social groups and even single families have been torn apart by the ridiculous process under the name 'brexit'... For myself, the best decision I made in my life was to leave the "U.K." - as a qualified engineer I saw the conditions and the norms which applied to fellow European engineers and wondered why I was bothering to work in my own country - there's a kind of story one could use to illustrate:-

A dinner party is being held. The doctor arrives and rings the doorbell, the hostess opens the door, welcomes him in - "Ah Doctor Atherton isn' it - do come in, let me put your jacket on the rail"... Along comes another neighbour, a lawyer... - "Oh David, we thought we might miss you, what with that takeover you're in Court with, so glad you could get away. Your favourite sherry's on the cabinet"...then along comes a design engineer, electronics or something, the doorbell goes, and... "Yes? Mr. Roberts? Ah yes, engineer, my husband mentioned you. There's a side door towards the back you can use. Oh and would you take your boots off please, we have new carpets. I think there's some tea in there."

In any event, the day I left to begin my further career in Europe was the day I almost tripled my salary, found better non-financial benefits too, and found living in an appropriate area to be less costly and more friendly, more social with less crime and less vandalism etc.
Society nearly everywhere has declined with more people, more aggression, less time, less acceptance but relatively speaking I'm still so very pleased that I made that decision. Now, if this were, say, 20+ years ago but with todays' conditions, I would probably be trying to relocate to more rural Germany or even attempt to enter Canada, work and career things being okay, of course.

So it's not all about the climate, or perhaps it is but then we're thinking of a different definition of the term "climate" for that is equally important.

I can also still clearly remember working with another very inventive and resourceful engineer on a particular project, where this engineer was the most cooperative and thoughtful one could imagine at the same time as thinking about aspects of the project from totally different perspective to mine, the combining of which led to a very successful outcome of the experiment involved. She was Canadian.
 
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Roger S

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That's a long story. Are we supposed to guess "fact or fiction"?
 

Trevor Gale

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Oh the story itself is of course fiction, but describes very well the attitude felt / shown by many towards Engineers - as if they are in some way far below a or Doctor or a Lawyer in 'social status', whatever that means. Please bear with me as I attempt to clarify, for in my posting I became distracted by my recollections. Basically I was trying to give my thoughts as to preferring one 'climate' rather than another which lead to my comparison of attitudes in one 'climate' (or country, society) versus another. My apologies for being somewhat verbose.

It is still common, right to this day, to hear on the television news something like "The Ford factory works at Laindon was brought to a standstill today as engineers began their 4-day strike. Their unions are demanding higher overtime pay.". Or some newspaper will run with the headline "Engineers call full 4-day strike, plant closed". The 'engineers' they refer to in such a news item are *not* engineers, neither are they technicians, for they are (often unqualified) production-line workers who perform some routine task at the line such as tightening the securing nuts on the gearbox.

My use of the fictional story was to illustrate this "class attitude" to Engineers in particular, where this spreads to the extent that many people simply have no idea what a 'qualified Engineer' actually means. I'd guess that even (sometimes) today, but certainly 15 -20 years ago, if one asked a typical "man in the street" to draw an image of an engineer, they'd sketch of a man (not a woman) in dirty blue overalls with a greasy spanner (wrench) in one hand and a union strike placard held up in the other.

That attitude spread further - even when employers knew exactly who they need as a qualified Engineer (e.g. for electronics interface design, definitely not for tightening wheel nuts), the pay grades they'd offer would not match those of, for example, a doctor or a lawyer with the same years of study and experience. A female engineer would also receive a lower salary offer then her male counterpart.

That was the main reason why I chose to leave the U.K. and move to Europe (eventually settling in the Netherlands where I also met my wife, a professional chartered interpreter/translator), where I joined the ranks of other qualified professionals in an appropriate working environment - here, the years of study and experience count for something and one is able to earn respect for achievements. Far less of the "class attitude" here, as well.

I appreciate the capabilities and understanding of other engineers and I respect their own ideas and thoughts even when they differ from my own, that's part of how cooperative working should function.

I also think I have a reasonably open mind, hence I thought I would mention my experience working with another (female) engineer (with a different background and outlook) on a project which was particularly demanding. It involved an experiment which we flew in some of the earlier "zero-G" test-flight campaigns (parabolic flights); thinking 'out of the box' from many unconventional angles and arguing many points of view (constructively) gave the best results. Fact, not fiction, by the way!

So it's still all about 'climate' - but in a rather broader sense than we started out with, I'll admit!
 
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